Minutes of the session
PLENARY MINUTES 2/2022
Minutes of the Plenary Meeting of the Small and Medium Enterprises Forum
held on October 17, 2022
Members representing the Tax Agency
Director of the Tax Management Department
Mrs. Rosa María Prieto del Rey
Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection
Mr. Javier Hurtado Puerta
Director of the Collection Department
Mrs. Virginia Muñoz Fernández
Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service
Mr. Ignacio Fraisero Aranguren
Deputy Director General of Applications - Department of Tax IT
Mrs. Cristina Álvarez Zazo
Deputy Director General of Studies, Methods and Procedures - Department of Financial and Tax Inspection
Mr. José Feliciano Morales Belinchón
Members representing Small and Medium Enterprises
Confederación Española de Organizaciones Empresariales (CEOE)
Head of Tax Area
Mr. Bernardo Soto Siles
Spanish Confederation of Small and Medium Enterprises (CEPYME)
Director of Economy and Sectoral Policies
D. Francisco Vidal Yuguero
Technical Secretariat of the Small and Medium Enterprises Forum
Deputy Director General of External Communication
Mrs. María Dolores Carreño Beltrán
On October 17, 2022, the second plenary session of the Small and Medium Enterprises Forum will be held, attended by the mentioned people, and in accordance with the following
AGENDA
-
Opening of the session.
-
Approval of the minutes of the meeting held on February 16, 2022.
-
Summary of the meetings of the Regulatory Analysis and digitalization project working group.
-
Assistance tools for SMEs.
-
Law 18/2022, of September 28, on business creation and growth: Obligation for all entrepreneurs and professionals to issue, send and receive electronic invoices in their commercial relationships with other entrepreneurs and professionals (electronic invoicing B2B ).
-
Next call: dates and topics to be discussed.
-
Other considerations, requests and questions.
1. Session opening
The session opens with Mr. Ignacio Fraisero Aranguren, Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service, who, after welcoming and thanking the attendees for their presence at the second session of the Plenary Session of the Forum of Small and Medium Enterprises, apologizes for the absence of Ms. Soledad Fernández Doctor, General Director of the Tax Agency and President of the Forum, who was prevented from attending the plenary session by scheduling problems.
Next, Mr. Ignacio Fraisero points out that, as has been commented on previous occasions, promoting the cooperative relationship model is one of the main objectives of the Tax Agency. In this sense, it indicates that, as is known by all those present, on September 8, the working group on the tax regime for the self-employed and SMEs was established, coordinated by the Institute of Fiscal Studies, and which has the participation of the Tax Agency, the General Directorate of Taxes, union organizations and associations that represent groups of SMEs and self-employed workers. Likewise, it adds that a meeting of the working group is scheduled for the end of October and requests the entities to send to the Secretariat of said group the issues that they consider would be appropriate to discuss in the session.
Next, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service comments that in the plenary session, after approving, if applicable, the minutes of the previous meeting, the representatives of the Departments of Financial and Tax Inspection, Tax Management and Collection will present the main issues addressed in the meetings of the Regulatory Analysis and digitalization project working group. In addition, Mr. Ignacio Fraisero adds that there will be a brief presentation on the virtual help tools that SMEs have, as well as on the mandatory nature of electronic invoicing established in Law 18/2022.
2. Approval of the minutes of the meeting held on February 16, 2022
Mr. Ignacio Fraisero gives the floor to Ms. Mª Dolores Carreño Beltrán, Deputy Director General of External Communication of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service and Technical Secretary of this Forum, who states that the minutes of the first session of the plenary session were sent to the representatives of small and medium-sized businesses prior to this meeting, with no comments having been received; He adds that, if there were not any at this time, it would be definitively approved. Since no observations were made, the minutes of the first plenary session that took place on February 16, 2022 are declared approved. Likewise, it points out that said minutes will be published on the electronic headquarters of the Tax Agency in the section dedicated to this Forum.
3. Summary of the meetings of the Regulatory Analysis and Digitalization Project working group
In relation to this item on the agenda, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service points out that the working group has met on two occasions, on May 11 and July 8, and that these meetings have been held jointly with the member entities of the Forum of Federations and Associations of Self-Employed Workers. He adds that the following issues were discussed, among others: the status of processing of the Royal Decree approving the regulation that establishes the requirements that computer or electronic systems and programs that support the billing processes of businessmen and professionals must adopt, and the standardization of billing record formats, the improvements in the assistance tools in completing the Corporate Tax returns and the new collection functionality incorporated into the
Next, Mr. Ignacio Fraisero gives the floor to Mr. Javier Hurtado Puerta, Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection, so that he can comment on the activity of the working group in the area of his Department.
Mr. Javier Hurtado begins his speech by pointing out that at the meeting held on May 11, a fairly extensive presentation was made of the status of the Royal Decree that approves the regulations that establish the requirements that must be adopted. the computer or electronic systems and programs that support the billing processes of businessmen and professionals, and the standardization of billing record formats , highlighting that the three pillars on which the project was based were the following:
1. Fight against tax fraud: The regulatory project has its origin in the modifications that Law 11/2021, in compliance with a mandate included in component 27 of the Recovery, Transformation and Resilience Plan, introduced in Law 58/2003, of December 17, General Tax in order to eradicate fraud due to the use of suppression and manipulation software.
2. Generation of an interoperability capacity through the standardization of billing record formats, so that a company can relate in an agile way with another or with entities from other sectors, such as the financial sector.
3. Administrative simplification: The possibility of sending invoices voluntarily and automatically is established through the use of "Verifiable invoice issuance systems" or "VERI*FACTU Systems", in which case, in order to comply with security requirements, no It would be necessary to implement the digital signature. The voluntary and simultaneous sending of invoices could in the future be the alternative to model 347 as a way of informing the Administration about billing, simplifying the tax settlement process. Likewise, there is the option of adopting a system that does not automatically send billing records to the Tax Agency, in which case the security requirements must be met by the system itself and with a higher level of rigor.
Likewise, Mr. Javier Hurtado comments that at the meeting the general lines of the project were outlined:
-
Universality, with some exceptions (those subject to the Immediate Information Supply system, certain operations that are taxed under the special regime for agriculture, livestock and fishing of VAT , etc.).
-
Its purpose is to regulate the way in which computer billing systems must comply with the legal requirements of integrity, conservation, accessibility, legibility, traceability and unalterability of records.
-
The following security requirements are determined:
-
Regulates the minimum content of the invoice registration file.
-
Establish a system of
hash chained -
Includes the electronic signature of the issuing system (except for "VERI*FACTU" systems).
-
-
Computer systems must have the capacity for simultaneous or subsequent submission of billing records.
-
Introduces the possibility that the person receiving an invoice can participate in the verification of the quality and integrity of their supplier's system, allowing them to compare the invoice received in the electronic headquarters of the Tax Agency.
-
It establishes that the computer systems used to comply with the obligations contained in the Regulation must necessarily have a responsible declaration of which there is a formal record, issued by the producer, manufacturer or developer thereof, which ensures the commitment on the part of the of this that the legally established requirements are met.
On the other hand, the Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection points out that, after the hearing and public information process, some modifications were introduced in the Regulations, and, in terms of deadlines, the following is provided:
-
For entities that develop and manufacture computer programs: They must have them on the market within 9 months from the publication in the BOE of the ministerial order issued in development of the Regulation.
-
For taxpayers: Computer systems adapted to the requirements established in the Regulation must be operational as of July 1, 2024.
To conclude his presentation on the Billing Regulations, Mr. Javier Hurtado indicates that at this time the draft Royal Decree is pending a report from the Council of State, so it is not possible to determine the date of entry into force.
Next, regarding the second meeting of the working group, the Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection comments that his Department's intervention was briefer, limiting itself to pointing out some aspects of Law 11/2021 on prevention and combat measures. against tax fraud that were still pending regulatory development. Thus, in relation to the modifications that were being processed in the General Regulation of actions and procedures for tax management and inspection and for the development of common standards for tax application procedures, approved by Royal Decree 1065/2007 , of July 27, referred to the new way of calculating late payment interest, to the entries in the constitutionally protected domicile and to the creation of the Registry of Extractors of fiscal warehouses of products included in the objective scope of the Hydrocarbons Tax. Likewise, in relation to this last modification, the importance that the Registry had for the Tax Agency was highlighted, since organized fraud in the distribution of diesel and gasoline was one of the most important quantitatively and the measure was intended to prevent that the benefits of the regime were used fraudulently to make purchases exempt from VAT under the regime, with accrual of the tax at exit, but without payment of the same to the Public Treasury.
Next, Mr. Ignacio Fraisero thanks the Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection for his presentation and gives the floor to Ms. Rosa Mª Prieto del Rey, Director of the Department of Tax Management, so that she can present the issues discussed in the group. of work in the area of your Department.
Ms. Rosa María Prieto points out that at the meeting held on July 8, the following issues in the tax management area were discussed, among others:
-
Advances in WEB Companies: The expansion of the data made available to the taxpayer and the improvements in its quality were highlighted. In addition, the different tools to help SMEs in this tax were presented and a series of utilities were highlighted, such as the table of corrections to the accounting result, the presentation notices or the incorporation into the form, although with certain limitations, of negative tax bases following a system
FIFO . -
Rules in process: The draft ministerial orders relating to informative declarations were discussed and, regarding the modifications provided for in Royal Decree 1065/2007, of July 27, a general review was carried out and, especially, those provided for in matters of censuses.
Next, Mr. Ignacio Fraisero thanks the Director of the Tax Management Department for her intervention and gives the floor to Ms. Virginia Muñoz Fernández, new Director of the Collection Department, so that she can comment on the issues discussed within the scope of her Department.
Ms. Virginia Muñoz points out that at the working group meeting it was commented that on July 4 she had joined the
Next, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service thanks the Director of the Collection Department for her presentation and offers the floor to those attending if they wish to ask any questions or comment on any issue.
Firstly, Mr. Bernardo Soto Siles, representative of the Spanish Confederation of Business Organizations (CEOE), takes the floor to comment that the new functionalities incorporated into the
Mr. Francisco Vidal Yuguero, representative of the Spanish Confederation of Small and Medium Enterprises (CEPYME), then intervenes to thank the simplification introduced in access to the usual procedures in the collection area with its inclusion in the
Mr. Ignacio Fraisero responds that, without a doubt, it is an issue that worries both SMEs and the Administration, since financing is important.
Since there are no more interventions, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service gives way to the next item on the agenda and gives the floor to the Director of the Tax Management Department.
4. Support tools for SMEs
Ms. Rosa María Prieto, who uses a presentation in power point in her presentation, indicates first of all that the Tax Agency has made it available to taxpayers, in order to facilitate compliance. of their tax obligations, a series of information and assistance services. In this sense, it points out that, through the Internet, at the electronic headquarters of the Tax Agency you can access extensive information on the different taxes, virtual assistance tools, chats ADI , to the written consultation service (INFOMA+), to the INFORMA program, etc. He adds that guides, “practical manuals” are also prepared ( Personal Income Tax , Wealth Tax, Corporate Tax, VAT , etc.), sections frequently asked questions, etc. Thus, it indicates that, regarding the virtual tax information services provided by the Tax Agency, the main tools that SMEs have, as well as their characteristics, are the following:
-
Virtual assistants: Based on artificial intelligence, they guide the user through simple tasks, offering specific answers in real time, which contributes to self-management. Their advantage is that they are available 365 days a year and 24 hours a day. Likewise, they provide greater certainty and legal security by offering the same response to all users who raise the same question (unity of criteria). Its main advantages are:
-
The analysis of the questions asked allows us to quickly and easily identify the topics that generate the most doubts in order to be able to give them an immediate response of general scope.
-
The tax professional and the taxpayer obtain an immediate response to their query.
-
Continued improvement of accessibility to administrative procedures with the aim of facilitating procedures for taxpayers and professionals.
-
The tools are designed for use by citizens, tax professionals and tax administration officials themselves.
-
Virtual assistants in IVA (AVIVA) and in SII (AVSII) provide a personalized automatic response, reinforcing legal certainty, although the information provided It is not binding, but it would avoid a penalty for those taxpayers who had adapted their behavior based on the response provided. They require electronic identification for their use and the responses are incorporated into the user's electronic file. Likewise, links to other applications and regulations are included in the answers in order to achieve comprehensive information. Regarding its operation, at the end of the conversation with the virtual assistant the user is offered the possibility of rating it. If they have obtained the information they needed, the user can obtain a written copy of it which, after the user's electronic identification, is incorporated into their electronic file and sent to them by email. If, on the other hand, you do not obtain the information you need, the following alternatives are offered:
- Inform +: The taxpayer can register his query in writing in the application. It is available for VAT , SII and Census issues. Currently, the maximum monthly number of consultations is five. Likewise, the service can be used by tax professionals, although authorization is required.
- Chat ADI : A chat is opened with a specialist to resolve your query at that moment. Office hours are Monday to Friday, from 9:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m.
-
-
Informants: They do not use artificial intelligence. They guide the user through the different options that are offered depending on their selections. Allows you to obtain a copy in
PDF of the response and can be complemented with assistance through the ADI . The main virtual informants are:-
In VAT : the Locator in the delivery of goods, the Locator for the provision of services, the Real Estate Qualifier, etc.
-
In Censuses: the Census Informant and the Search engine for economic activities and their tax obligations.
-
Next, Ms. Rosa María Prieto points out that through the electronic headquarters of the Tax Agency you can access the following assistance services for preparing the declarations:
-
Comprehensive Digital Assistance Administrations: Its main characteristics are the following:
-
They provide in a personalized non-face-to-face manner certain information and assistance services that are usually offered in a physical office of the Tax Agency. Their hours, as already indicated, are Monday to Friday, from 9:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m.
-
Multichannel: They use the different telematic tools that current technology allows (chats, phone calls, video calls,...).
-
The ADI are attended by officials specialized in each subject who, supported by ad hoc IT tools, allow for streamlining and optimizing assistance.
-
The service is available for the following models:
- VAT : models 303, 390 and 952.
- Censuses: models 030, 036 and 037.
- Contributors in modules: models 303 and 131.
- E-commerce: models 035 and 369.
-
-
PRE 303: Available to all taxpayers, different options are offered depending on their profile. Among its functionalities we can highlight:
-
Census window VAT : shows the identification boxes completed, allowing the taxpayer to update, correct or complete the data that has an impact on the settlement.
-
Portfolio of installments to be compensated: table with information on the amounts to be offset from previous periods, broken down by financial years and generation periods, amounts applied and pending application.
-
Complementary self-assessment: When this option is checked, the system completes, in cases where the data is available, the amount and receipt number of the self-assessment to be supplemented.
-
All entrepreneurs will be able to obtain a PRE 303 with the settlement data based on the information in their VAT Registration Books in a standardized electronic format (import of Books).
-
-
WEB Companies:
-
It was launched for the declaration of the 2019 financial year. Information corresponding to 72 concepts was offered, among which we can highlight: the data entered by the taxpayer in other models (information on administrators, items pending application,...), the data provided by third parties (ownership of real estate, income from movable capital,...), as well as other information held by the Tax Agency (penalties, surcharges,…).
-
For fiscal year 2020, new categories were added, such as imputed income in SII and in model 347. Likewise, the most important novelty was the incorporation of the possibility of downloading part of the tax data in the WEB Companies form.
-
In 2021, new utilities have been incorporated:
- the information related to the items pending application at the beginning of the year of adjustments to the accounting result;
- the calculation of the negative tax bases pending application;
- the generation of a series of notices when submitting the declaration.
-
Next, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service opens a session of interventions.
Mr. Francisco Vidal comments that, without a doubt, virtual tools are very useful, but that there is a segment of taxpayers for whom in-person attention is very necessary, since they do not know how all these virtual services are used. He adds that the characteristics of rural areas must also be kept in mind.
Ms. Rosa María Prieto answers that virtual services do not replace in-person services, but rather complement them.
Mr. Bernardo Soto points out that he agrees with the usefulness of virtual tools, since they allow, especially in basic issues, to offload work from face-to-face services. On the other hand, it indicates that with regard to Corporate Tax, the transparency of information by the Administration is a fundamental help when completing the declaration.
Next, given that there is no other intervention, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service gives way to the next item on the agenda and gives the floor to Mr. Javier Hurtado.
5. Law 18/2022, of September 28, on business creation and growth: Obligation for all entrepreneurs and professionals to issue, send and receive electronic invoices in their commercial relationships with other entrepreneurs and professionals (electronic invoicing B2B )
The Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection begins his presentation by pointing out that Law 18/2022 represents a very significant change in billing obligations, since it provides that, after the entry into force of the Law and the passage of the transitional periods established, the mandatory nature of electronic invoicing B2B is universal. He adds that the explanatory memorandum sets out the two objectives to be achieved: provide greater efficiency to business traffic and facilitate access to information on payment terms. On the other hand, Mr. Javier Hurtado indicates that the electronic invoice is not something new, but its universality and the requirements established in the Law are. Thus, it points out that the electronic invoice in Spain has been going through different moments that, in turn, allow the following classifications to be made:
-
Due to its format:
-
Electronic invoice with unstructured format: currently in force, since there is no rule that requires a certain structure in billing records.
-
Electronic invoice with structured format:
- Private or agreed structured format between sender and receiver: widely used by large distributors (for example, automotive).
- Standard, interoperable public structured format ( B2G ).
-
-
For its recipients:
-
Electronic invoice B2G : Law 25/2013, promoting electronic invoices in the public sector, establishes that all public sector entities, whether local, regional or state, receive their invoices through Facturae, with some exceptions (individuals and operations whose amount is up to 5,000 euros).
-
Electronic invoice B2B : Its obligation is established in Law 18/2022, on the creation and growth of companies, and the consent of the recipient is not necessary. In addition, the invoice payment statuses must be included.
-
Electronic invoice B2C : Law 56/2007, on Measures to Promote the Information Society, makes it mandatory for certain issuers and as long as there is consent from the recipient.
-
Mr. Javier Hurtado continues his presentation by commenting that Law 18/2022 does not have a fiscal purpose, since it has been promoted by the Ministry of Economic Affairs and Digital Transformation in compliance with the Recovery, Transformation and Resilience Plan, being one of its objectives. the modernization of the business sector, especially SMEs and the self-employed, by promoting their digitalization, as well as reducing late payments; adds that the Law addresses electronic invoicing in its article 12, although it also appears in other sections of its articles. Thus, the Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection points out that of the provisions of the Law he will highlight and comment on the following:
-
Universality: All entrepreneurs and professionals must issue, send and receive electronic invoices in their commercial relationships with other entrepreneurs and professionals.
-
Establishes that the invoice must include information about the payment status: This is a new element that is not included in the regulations relating to billing obligations, but for the Law it is a key element in order to reduce commercial late payments. For the Tax Agency, this is an element whose technical and regulatory development is highly complex, since it involves converting the invoice into a dynamic element that is monitored until payment.
-
It indicates that the recipient of the invoice will not be able to force its issuer to use a predetermined electronic invoicing solution, platform or service provider. With this measure, the Law aims to avoid situations of dominance in the market by large operators.
-
It provides that the technological solutions and platforms offered by companies providing electronic invoicing services to entrepreneurs and professionals must guarantee their free interconnection and interoperability, which does not necessarily imply that the electronic invoicing service provided by the provider also has to be gratuitous. Mr. Javier Hurtado adds that for the Tax Agency to develop an electronic invoicing service that takes into account all the profiles that make up the taxpayer census would be a very complex task, the implementation of which, in principle, could not be prepared in the short term; However, the possibility of developing an alternative electronic invoicing system for microenterprises that issue a very small number of invoices is being studied. Likewise, he indicates that, in his opinion, the cost of billing services will become cheaper as they become more widespread.
-
It points out that electronic invoices must comply, in any case, with the provisions of the specific regulations on billing and that the computer systems and programs that manage the billing and conservation processes of electronic invoices must respect the requirements referred to in the article. 29.2.j) of Law 58/2003, General Tax, and its regulatory development. Thus, the technical solutions adopted in compliance with the provisions of Law 18/2022 must necessarily take into account and be combined with the measures included in the draft Royal Decree approving the regulation that establishes the requirements that They must adopt computer or electronic systems and programs that support the billing processes of businessmen and professionals, discussed in the third point of the agenda.
-
Final Provision 7 empowers the Government to implement the regulations of the Law and, in relation to Article 12, states that the Ministries of Economic Affairs and Digital Transformation and of Finance and Public Service, within the scope of their competencies, will determine the technical and information requirements to be included in the electronic invoice for the purposes of verifying the payment date and obtaining the average payment periods, the minimum interoperability requirements between providers of electronic invoice technological solutions, and the requirements of security, control and standardization of the computer devices and systems that generate the documents. The period established for regulatory development is six months. Likewise, it provides that the development will be carried out accepting as valid, at least, the list of syntax contained in the Implementing Decision (EU) 2017/1870 of the Commission, of October 16, 2017, on the publication of the reference of the European standard on electronic invoicing and the list of its syntaxes in accordance with Directive 2014/55/EU of the European Parliament and of the Council [XML CEFAT/UN (SCRDM – CII), UBL – ISO/IEC 19845:2015 and EDIFACT].
-
Regarding its entry into force:
-
for entrepreneurs and professionals with a turnover greater than 8 million euros: one year from the approval of the regulatory development;
-
for the rest: 2 years.
-
Next, Mr. Javier Hurtado comments on the main characteristics of the two options in terms of billing systems:
-
Through a standard format
EDI for the direct exchange of information between two organizations electronically (peer-to-peer): The invoice (or any other document) is transmitted from the sender's equipment, previously transformed into EDI format, to that of the receiver, where it is decoded and is received. -
Through platforms provided by billing service providers: It follows the French model where the platform itself serves as a transmitter and receiver of information. A node platform (Chorus) is also contemplated that can be used by suppliers or clients who, due to their characteristics, simply require minimum services that allow them to comply with legal requirements. With the Chorus platform, the submission of information to the Administration is automatic. On the other hand, in the Italian model the platform is provided by the Tax Administration, which acts as an invoice endorser.
Finally, the Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection points out that, in his opinion, Law 18/2022 marks a milestone in terms of billing, with a significant impact from a tax point of view, as well as for companies.
The Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service thanks Mr. Javier Hurtado for his presentation and comments that Law 18/2022 represents a challenge for everyone. He adds that the Ministry of Finance and Public Service will collaborate with the Ministry of Economic Affairs and Digital Transformation so that regulatory development can provide consensual solutions to all the issues raised by the Law.
Next, Mr. Ignacio Fraisero offers the floor to the attendees.
Firstly, Mr. Bernardo Soto intervenes to ask if everything has to go through the platforms, to which Mr. Javier Hurtado responds that this issue is not specified in the Law, although it seems that from the Ministry of Economic Affairs and Digital Transformation They want to promote a model similar to the French one.
Mr. Bernardo Soto then reports that at the end of September they held a meeting with representatives of the General Directorate of Economic Policy of the Ministry of Economic Affairs and Digital Transformation, in order to comment on the responses they had obtained from their associates in relation to a battery of questions that the Ministry had provided them in a previous meeting. Thus, it points out that in several of the questions they had not been able to offer a common position on the part of the Confederation, since very different answers had been received from the members. On the other hand, at the meeting the representatives of the Ministry reported that the deadline for regulatory development was six months, so the public participation periods were going to be minimal, although a communication channel would be maintained throughout the process. informal in nature. The representative of CEOE adds that the entities representing SMEs requested the creation of a billing forum, analogous to those established for the implementation of FACe and FACeB2B, but the Ministry told them that due to the deadlines they saw it as complicated, although they would study it. For its part, the General Directorate of Economic Policy insisted that reducing commercial late payment was a key element and, regarding payment information, it was reiterated that it was not a fiscal measure and that it was thinking about enabling coexistence of different models, which could fall on the financial entities or the issuer of the invoices. Likewise, the Ministry stated that they were preparing a report with all the contributions collected from different areas and that they would send it to the representatives of the SMEs. Mr. Bernardo Soto comments that they have not received it yet. On the other hand, he informs that tomorrow they will hold a meeting of the electronic invoicing working group at the CEOE , where an attempt will be made to unify, as far as possible, the proposals of the partners about what should be done to solve all these problems and, in addition, they will be informed about what was discussed in the plenary session. Finally, he points out that in the meeting with the General Directorate he thought he understood that the use of a platform was not going to be mandatory, but rather that a point-to-point system was being considered. He adds that it was not mentioned that there would be a node or platform of the Administration in the services of the Tax Agency.
Mr. Javier Hurtado reiterates that it is not explicitly included, but that, in his opinion, the Ministry of Economic Affairs and Digital Transformation is in favor of a system similar to the French model, which, on the other hand, is not yet in force.
Mr. Bernardo Soto once again takes the floor to indicate that the ideal would be that, on the one hand, this regulatory development is integrated and perfectly combined with the draft Royal Decree discussed in the third point of the agenda and, on the other hand, that The information on the payment status of the invoice does not impose an exorbitant burden on the person who will ultimately be its beneficiary, the businessman, since he is the one who has the greatest interest in reducing late payment.
The Director of the Department of Financial and Tax Inspection comments that, in relation to the information on payment statuses, perhaps it would be more convenient to limit it to significant operations or to companies that have some control in the market, that is, that can condition the payment and the collection of invoices, but that from the Ministry of Economic Affairs and Digital Transformation they are in favor of a universal model and that the information is included in all invoices and thus global and statistical monitoring can be carried out.
Mr. Bernardo Soto indicates that there are aspects that must be reviewed and corrected since the fact of reporting on payment statuses can influence them. He adds that, on the other hand, when the Immediate Information Supply system was implemented there was a fairly long period of time and that the problem in this case is, above all, that the adaptation periods are short.
Mr. Francisco Vidal then intervenes to point out that information on late payment is already available, since, for example, the Bank of Spain is treating data for the year 2020 in a fairly comprehensive and well-prepared way based on a sample, in his opinion. , sufficiently representative, of 465,000 companies; It adds that it also has not only the data from the Central Integrated Balance Sheet survey, but also, earlier, it has the quarterly surveys, which are quite detailed and also provide information on trends. In addition, the data is integrated with information from other organizations such as the Commercial Registry. Thus, it indicates that the Bank of Spain has certain information regarding how commercial credit evolves, although it understands that this information is complex to obtain since the Bank of Spain has to review the data provided; However, it reiterates that information is available and that, perhaps, by selecting an ad hoc sample detailed data on commercial late payment could be obtained. On the other hand, it indicates that it has a report prepared by a CESCE company that also provides information on commercial credits, although it does not resolve doubts regarding the exact level of delay in the payments and the agreed average payment periods, since going into detail in this matter is a task that is sometimes incomprehensible and, in their opinion, electronic invoicing platforms are going to have to face a very complex task. Finally, he comments that, obviously, late payment is a serious problem that greatly worries SMEs, but that, as everyone present knows, the increase in commercial credit is cyclical and in inflationary times it is a simple way to obtain financing, especially if you are going through a compromising situation. Likewise, it reiterates that we must work with a sample of companies that allow us to have the information sooner, but without the effort itself entailing unaffordable costs and burdens.
Mr. Javier Hurtado comments that the Ministry of Economic Affairs and Digital Transformation is aware of the data provided by the Bank of Spain and reiterates that, however, it seems that it prefers to have universal information, provided by the companies themselves.
Mr. Bernardo Soto then takes the floor to indicate that greater simplicity and ease in the process of adaptation to the new electronic billing systems and these in themselves will benefit everyone, since although for the advisors and managers, as tax professionals that they are, there will not be major adaptation problems no matter how complex the process is, as well as for large companies, where the cost will be minimal, this is not the case for a significant portion of small and medium-sized companies. companies that currently simply have a small internal department, which often consists of a single person who, without being very expert, deals with accounting and billing, and who are going to be forced to hire an advisor the provision of these services.
Next, given that there are no more interventions, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service gives way to the sixth point on the agenda.
6. Next call: dates and subjects to deal with
In relation to this point on the agenda, Mr. Ignacio Fraisero comments that, as everyone present knows, the Forum's operating rules establish the holding of two plenary meetings per year. Thus, he adds that, however, it has been found that sometimes the content of the sessions coincides with that of the plenary meetings of the Forum of Federations and Associations of Self-Employed Workers. Mr. Ignacio Fraisero points out that, for this reason, the Tax Agency proposes to the representatives of small and medium-sized companies to modify these Operating Rules so that the possibility of jointly holding the plenary sessions of both Forums is included, when the matter so requires. advise. On the other hand, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service indicates that, given that the work of the Forum is fundamentally carried out in working groups, a modification of the rules is also proposed to establish the holding of a meeting as mandatory. plenary session per year, adding the possibility that the Plenary Session can be convened on more occasions if any of the parties consider it appropriate. Likewise, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service communicates that this proposal will also be conveyed to the representatives of self-employed workers. Finally, it informs that the Technical Secretariat will send a proposal to modify the Operating Rules, so that the representatives of small and medium-sized companies can analyze it and provide their observations and comments.
7. Other considerations, requests and questions
Next, the Director of the Planning and Institutional Relations Service offers the floor to the people present at the meeting in case they wish to make any comments and, since no intervention takes place, he thanks all the people for their attendance and concludes the second session. plenary session of the Small and Medium Enterprises Forum.
THE TECHNICAL SECRETARY
Ms. Mª Dolores Carreño Beltrán
Vº Bº
THE DIRECTOR OF THE DEPARTMENT
OF TAX MANAGEMENT
(replacing the General Director
of the Tax Agency)
Mrs. Rosa María Prieto del Rey